Hi all. I have been watching the Openreach engineers around my way doing work for the last few months, and have now seen that FTTC is available in my area! Thank god as I am over 5KM away from the exchange, and currently get about 1.5mb connection. I've also found speeds being a bit slower during peak hours, which, when I don't have much to play with, can be crippling. 720p youtube or iPlayer content is a no-no, even on a good day.
So initially I though BT would be my only option, and I was VERY unenthusiastic about them being my ISP, when, with a bit of net research, I cam across IDNet. I like the look of the packages.
So, i'm almost ready to order, But just wanted to check a few things. Am I right in thinking that it doesn't matter who my telephone provider is? i.e I can stay with sky, and just cancel broadband with them, get my MAC code and move to IDNet?
I'm also a tiny but concerned about my current wiring at my house. When I moved in I had one single phone line. This came in from outside, but was connected directly to the wall, it ran down a length of wire a few meters long and was in a normal socket. I'm guessing this is the master socket. I do not have another socket anywhere else in the house.
I was just concerned as the installation guidance states that there cannot be any extension.
Also it states on the order page that someone can be out within 5 days to install/activate it. I have to give Sky 31 days, but can I still go ahead and have IDNet connected within that time (obviously still paying for the final month with Sky)
Also it states that I can supply my own router. I have the standard Netgear Sky router at the moment and an Apple Airport Extreme. Is the supplied (at cost) router from IDNet the best option, or would people recommend purchasing my own, any recommendations? (I got the Airport Extreme as the Sky router doesn't play nice with the iPhone 4, so I'm guessing that if the new router needed for IDNet has 802.11n, then I might be able to do away with the Airport if I so fancied?)
Many thanks for any feedback. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that all will go well. I moved from a rented flat with 20MB ADSL, out to our first house, in a semi rural area. I had a slight shock to the system when I found out what our speeds would be out here, so I am sure you can imagine how much i've anticipated Fibre since it was announced in our area!!
Hi,
I moved from Be a few months back, but the move from Sky should be more or less the same, so i offer my £0.02 bellow! i would add that I'm just an IDNet customer, I don't work for them or have any connection beyond paying them each month. ;)
> So initially I though BT would be my only option, and I was VERY unenthusiastic about them being my ISP, when, with a bit of net
> research, I cam across IDNet. I like the look of the packages.
Personal view is avoid BT at ALL costs - do some mooching on their support site and you'll see just what a hash they've been making of their service over the last 3 months or so. This gives you a flavour...
http://community.bt.com/t5/BB-in-Home/INFINITY-Netwrok-wide-Issues-IMPORTANT/td-p/81365
Suffice to say, IDNet and Zen customers saw little if any impact, Infinity customers were up in arms. IDNet are a little dearer than BT, but like everything else you get what you pay for.
> So, i'm almost ready to order, But just wanted to check a few things. Am I right in thinking that it doesn't matter who my telephone
> provider is? i.e I can stay with sky, and just cancel broadband with them, get my MAC code and move to IDNet?
I may be wrong but I believe you need a BT line, so you'll have to leave Sky Talk. Sales will help you but IDNet offer voice lines or you could do what I do and have your line from BT and IDNet providing the broadband. In effect you'll just have Sky TV and none of the bolt ons.
> I'm also a tiny but concerned about my current wiring at my house. When I moved in I had one single phone line. This came in from
> outside, but was connected directly to the wall, it ran down a length of wire a few meters long and was in a normal socket. I'm
> guessing this is the master socket. I do not have another socket anywhere else in the house. I was just concerned as the installation
> guidance states that there cannot be any extension.
I don't think that's of any concern It sounds like standard "rural" post wiring - and internal wiring shouldn't be a problem as the engineer fits a faceplate that isolates any extension wiring when he does your install.
> Also it states on the order page that someone can be out within 5 days to install/activate it. I have to give Sky 31 days, but can I
> still go ahead and have IDNet connected within that time (obviously still paying for the final month with Sky)
When I migrated from Be, I was without service for 10 minutes. It no doubt could be longer, but the engineer disconnects the line to Sky at the same time as they install the Fibre service so I don't see why it should be longer (that said my install was *very* smooth).
I did exactly what you are proposing - used my MAC early and was turned off and on at the same time but I was BT line to BT line, moving your line from Sky to BT may complicate things.
<snip router choices>
You need buy nothing. All you need is your existing Airport Extreme - it plugs straight into the BT modem, so you don't need to buy anything, your existing kit will be fine. The only thing for you to worry about is which model of Airport you have - if it's one of the dual band ones it's perfect - if it's one of the older (say 3 year+ old) Airports, it will struggle to keep pace with the 40mbps service. it will maintain around 30mbps but for the full 40mpbs you'll need one of the newer ones.
The faster models are MB053LL/A MB763LL/A and MC340LL/A.
FWIW I'd rate the Airport as a far better piece of kit than the Netgear, but them I use Apple throughout the house so I might just be a bit biased. ;-)
Configuration is easy too - just connect up once the engineer says you're live and then run Airport Utility. Select the PPPoE checkbox and tell it your username and password when it asks for them.
--
Anton.
:karma: :welc: shorn
As long as you have a physical BT phone line then it doesn't matter if the voice aspect is with another reseller. I was with Talk Talk when I joined IDNet so the fact you get your voice aspect provided by Sky should make no difference at all.
Quote from: .Griff. on Jan 15, 2011, 20:24:44
As long as you have a physical BT phone line then it doesn't matter if the voice aspect is with another reseller. I was with Talk Talk when I joined IDNet so the fact you get your voice aspect provided by Sky should make no difference at all.
Were you LLU unbundled though? I'm not sure if that makes a difference or not, but (as far as I'm aware) the physical line is owned by the LLU provider so BT are a bit limited as to what they can do with it?
Quote from: Anton on Jan 15, 2011, 20:26:41
Were you LLU unbundled though?
Yes. With Be.
However thinking about it some more didn't Sky start offering "fully unbundled" services where they used their own equipment for both the voice and data aspect of the line? If so then granted the OP may have a problem.
In my case Be only unbundled the data aspect of the SMPF.
Quote from: .Griff. on Jan 15, 2011, 20:31:39
Didn't Sky start offering "fully unbundled" services
I have a feeling you're right and I think OpenReach then operate the line for them as owners. I'm pretty sure Sky offer two levels of LLU (one voice only and another line unbundled).
Question for OP is who invoices him for Line Rental? If it's BT, he's good to go, if it's on his Sky invoice things could be more complex.
(mutter mutter bl&*dy Murdoch...) ;-)
Hi there. Thanks for the reply.
So we agree on avoiding BT, thats good.
With regards to the phone line. It gives an option on the sign up page to "keep my current telephone provider" - This is why I assumed that it didn't matter who you were with. There is also nothing on the website that states you must have a BT line. I assumed that the fibre was separate to standard ADSL so your broadband and telephone were separate, therefore it doesn't matter if you have different providers? Again its just assumptions!
Thats good news about my current kit, as the Airport Extreme is one of the latest dual band models. (Only a few months old) and I got it as I knew it had internal revisions over the last AE. However I'm a tad confused as to what you mean by it plugs into the BT Modem. I do not have a BT modem, just a Sky Router. (Netgear DG834GT IIRC.)
Think I'm gonna call Sky and get my MAC code. Will sign up online and speak to sales on Monday, check all is OK with the line.
EDIT: OK typed the above and realised that there were a few more replies....
To answer another question raised, yes I get both Talk package and pay Sky for line rental. Guessing I could just sign up for the lot with IDNet?
If you line is LLU IDNet will accept the migration http://forums.thinkbroadband.com/which_isp/t/2654786-re-list-of-isps-that-accept-llu-mac-keys.html
That was for IPstream, so they may have changed the way they are handled.
OK, whats the easiest way to tell if my line is LLU?
I think the quickest way will be to call Sky and ask.
Quote from: shorn on Jan 15, 2011, 20:42:15
Thats good news about my current kit, as the Airport Extreme is one of the latest dual band models. (Only a few months old) and I got it as I knew it had internal revisions over the last AE. However I'm a tad confused as to what you mean by it plugs into the BT Modem. I do not have a BT modem, just a Sky Router. (Netgear DG834GT IIRC.)
The sky router is no good for FTTC. When BT come to install you, they'll bring with them a new modem, specifically for VDSL. The Sky router is then disconnected and disposed of.
The Modem BT install gives you a single WAN port. The WAN port of the Airport Extreme plugs into that.
You have no option but to use the BT supplied modem, it's integral to their service. You do have to provide a router though (I.E. your Airport) as otherwise you'll just have a single socket to connect a single Machine to.
Added Dodgy and very poorly done schematic... ;-)
A few things...
i) I'm unsure about the situation relating to broadband from any provider when paying line rental to anyone other than BT Retail. A friend of mine has Sky TV, pays his phone line rental to Sky and has Sky Talk for calls but he used to have Bethere for broadband. He's now switched that to Sky. When I was with Bulldog for Broadband and phone line rental, it was suggested on thinkbroadband.com to contact BT and do a "request to doner" whereby BT Retail would take my line back under their control. That is what I did and how I finished with Bulldog. I was then able to keep the voice element with BT and have the broadband element with anyone I wanted. I'd like some more clarification on this myself.
ii) It is possible to have Sky Talk and keep phone line rental with BT Retail. I know several people who have. In relation to (i) I am not sure about paying line rental to anyone other than BT Retail if you want broadband from an unrelated provider.
iii) If you are on Sky Broadband, excluding their Connect product, you'll be LLU.
This is looking good!
I understand now that the engineer will bring a BT Modem, and I will connect that into my Airport Extreme. Sky router gets retired.
I have checked on SamKnows and it states that my area is enabled for Sky LLU. I know for sure that I am not using there connect package, so I will happily take a stab at the fact that I am on LLU.
WIll be phoning very shortly for my MAC code, with an order for IDNet going through very shortly after the MAC is received. Anyone know how long a MAC code takes to come through?
Quote from: shorn on Jan 15, 2011, 20:59:00
This is looking good!
I understand now that the engineer will bring a BT Modem, and I will connect that into my Airport Extreme. Sky router gets retired.
I have checked on SamKnows and it states that my area is enabled for Sky LLU. I know for sure that I am not using there connect package, so I will happily take a stab at the fact that I am on LLU.
WIll be phoning very shortly for my MAC code, with an order for IDNet going through very shortly after the MAC is received. Anyone know how long a MAC code takes to come through?
MAC code request time depends how how quick the supplier is at progressing it. I think there is a rule that they must supply it within a certain period. I forget if it it is 7 days or what. You might want to look on skyuser.co.uk and see if it's being discussed there in relation to Sky.
Please let us know if you do/are able to keep paying your phone line rental to Sky, but can successfully switch your broadband element out to an unrelated provider (i.e. IDnet), or whether you are forced to switch your phone line rental back to BT Retail (which would allow you to keep Sky Talk), or pick IDnet for your voice calls. :)
On the phone to Sky now, confirmed it was LLU. Just processing MAC code now.....
(I guess I'll see whether it is ok when the order goes through to IDNet and they process it!)
Woohoo, MAC code provided straight away over the phone!
Quote from: shorn on Jan 15, 2011, 21:08:16
On the phone to Sky now, confirmed it was LLU. Just processing MAC code now.....
(I guess I'll see whether it is ok when the order goes through to IDNet and they process it!)
Blimey - talk about striking while the iron's hot!
You're as excited as I was now! ;-)
PS - What exchange are you on?
Order placed with IDNet. I'm on the TOTTON exchange.
Very Excited! ;D
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/1113106612.png) (http://www.speedtest.net)
This is what I currently get. I'm keeping all fingers crossed, and hopefully soon I'll see a bit of a shift!
And this is mine...
Oh, and when I just ran this, My eldest was streaming a 720p rental on the Apple TV and my beloved is downloading a moving from iTunes.
Life is good... ;-)
Very nice.
To be honest I don't think I'm gonna get that fast. The availability checkers all say 26 Down and 5.5 up. Still a helluva gain over what I have now.
My move to Apple products started with the iPhone. I then got an iMac (given to me, can you believe!), and upgrading the broadband will help with the AppleTV that I purchased, so I could do away with my Media PC. (Windows will finally be gone from my life!)
This should make browsing more enjoyable on my much anticipated iPad 2 when its finally released!
I know people complain that their products are expensive, and they are, however I remind people that I'm running a 5 year old iMac, with all the latest software an updates. It fly's and gives me no issues whatsoever. I'm pleased to be finally (hopefully) treating it to some decent internet speeds!
:welcome: :karma: shorn
:welc: :karma: shorn.
Welcome to the forum, shorn. :welc: :karma:
Nice answers from the rest of you guys, have a karma too. :)
Thanks for the welcome, and for the many helpful replies I received. I will keep you updated with how things go!!
:fingers:
Hi Shorn,
(http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/Smileys/custom/welc_idnetters.png)(http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/Smileys/custom/karma.png)
On the speed thing, I went live on Wednesday. The BT checker suggested 33 down 8 up and 5 minutes after switch on I was getting 37 down 8 up. The BT engineer said in the 6 months+ he'd been doing FTTC installs he hadn't connected anyone sub 30
Ed
:welc: :karma: Shorn.
Yey! Had my order confirmation come through today, and I have been given a "committed" delivery date on 24th January. All good so far.
Out of interest, I signed up for the Home Pro Fibre package. Now this obviously attracts a monthly download limit. How does this limit work? Is it on a month to month basis, i.e. the limit resets at the beginning of every calendar month, or is it a rolling 30 day period?
I'm sure i'll be fine, but having moved from an unlimited package, I guess I'll have to keep an eye on things, especially as I have upgraded with the ATV in mind. I'm sure the HD movie rentals will use a fair bit of the peak time allowance.
:thumb:
The download allowance runs from the 1st of each month, Shorn.
Quote from: shorn on Jan 17, 2011, 22:19:11I have upgraded with the ATV in mind. I'm sure the HD movie rentals will use a fair bit of the peak time allowance.
IIRC you can download the movies on to your hard drive during off-peak and have a month in which to watch them. I've never actually rented anything from iTunes though, so I'd suggest you have a look through the rental T&C's.
Edit- found the relevant bit:
Quote(ix) Film Rentals
(a) Film rentals are viewable on only one device at a time. You must be connected to the Service when moving film rentals, and you may do so only between your computer and other compatible devices. Films rented using your Apple TV or iPad may not be moved. If you move a film to a compatible device and then use the Service to restore that device, or choose Settings > Reset > Erase all content and settings on that device, the film will be permanently deleted.
(b) You have thirty (30) days after downloading a film to begin viewing. Once you begin viewing, you have forty-eight (48) hours to finish viewing the film. Stopping, pausing, or restarting a film does not extend the available time for viewing.
.
.
.
Quote from: shorn on Jan 17, 2011, 22:19:11
I'm sure i'll be fine, but having moved from an unlimited package, I guess I'll have to keep an eye on things, especially as I have upgraded with the ATV in mind. I'm sure the HD movie rentals will use a fair bit of the peak time allowance.
Two things:
1. The IDNet RSS feed is really useful - it puts you in control and gives you a daily update on bandwidth used, so you can actively manage your usage. I found I was using just a little more than the 30gb peak cap product, but rather than worry about over runs upgraded to the 50gb cap. I have no problem and now always have 5-10gb free at the end of the month (so download like crazy from 25th onwards ;-).
To give that context, I work from home via VPN (and Outlook is pretty chatty at the best of times), download perhaps 5 or 6 itunes rentals a month and both my partner, myself and my eldest are heavy net users often all three of us online for a couple of hours in the evening.
2. Apple TV rentals, being 720p are typically 700mb for a SD file and around 1.25gb for a HD feature don't eat into your cap at the rate they could if they were 1080p!
The trick is to migrate anything you don't need to do in peak to off peak. For example I tend to run software update in OS X every few weeks but at 8:00am as I'm still in off-peak so software updates take place while I'm having my cornflakes!
Finally, I've managed to pick up a BT Vision+ box for free - I'm going to see if I can con it into working this evening... ;-)
Thats great, thank you for the replies.
With regards to the off peak downloads, I was hoping that with the faster connection speed, downloading prior to watching a movie would not be necessary. This is what will make the ATV a very much "on demand" service. I sit down with the wife at 7pm, see a HD movie that we like the look of, click "Rent" and off we go. So obviously this would be streamed at peak time.
But if its reset at the beginning of the month, then that makes it pretty easy to keep track of.
Especially if you take the RSS feed. You'll get your daily actual usage plus a projected usage for the month.
Yep. I'll look into the rss feed. That will be very handy!
Quote from: shorn on Jan 18, 2011, 17:01:24
With regards to the off peak downloads, I was hoping that with the faster connection speed, downloading prior to watching a movie would not be necessary. This is what will make the ATV a very much "on demand" service. I sit down with the wife at 7pm, see a HD movie that we like the look of, click "Rent" and off we go. So obviously this would be streamed at peak time.
HD Apple TV movies launch in under 5 seconds... ;-)
Less time than you take to read this then.
Quote from: pctech on Jan 18, 2011, 18:32:09
Less time than you take to read this then.
;-)
We're all mad here. ;)
You don't have to be of course but it helps.
Quote from: pctech on Jan 18, 2011, 18:41:00
You don't have to be of course but it helps.
So I'm starting to see! :whistle: :laugh:
;D
Quote from: Rik on Jan 18, 2011, 17:11:52
Especially if you take the RSS feed. You'll get your daily actual usage plus a projected usage for the month.
Just one tip - Rik might correct me on this. The 'projected usage' on the RSS feed, simply takes the first day's (or two or three) usage and multiplies it up by the appropriate amount to give a 'projected' monthly total. If on the first day you download a couple of OSX combo updaters and (say) a film or two, the next time you look at the RSS estimate for the month it will be wildly exaggerated, since you are unlikely to be doing the same every day of the month.
People new to iDNet tend to get worried about this, but once you realise how it works and arrange your downloading accordingly you'll be fine.
I actually had my first warning email this month telling me I would go over my allowance simply because I happened to do some heavy downloads at the beginning of the month. In practice it levels out and few people experience problems.
Tac, it bases the projection from your last 7 days usage.
QuoteIf your previous 7 days rate of usage continues for 31 days then the total for the month will be:
Quote from: Tacitus on Jan 18, 2011, 19:26:12
People new to iDNet tend to get worried about this, but once you realise how it works and arrange your downloading accordingly you'll be fine.
Once you realise how it works you arrange your downloading to see how high you can get it to go and still stay within your allowance at the end of the month :evil:
I think my best effort has been about 85GB ;D
Uploads aren't bad either and you're not restricted on them - I fell off my seat yesterday when I did an upload to Flickr for the first time since having FTTC (it took them longer to process the pic than it did for me to upload) ;D
OK well, BT Openreach Enginner has just left. When he tested it with his bit of kit he said it was connecting at 39 down and 10 up. I'm all connected and using the Airport Extreme. First test 10 minutes ago ran in at 25down and 5.5 up,
Just a minute ago...
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/1125191506.png) (http://www.speedtest.net)
Heres hoping it settles down around this speed (or more!) over the next week/10 days.
Very Happy!!
:thumb:
Enjoy. :)
:thumb:
It is nice, although I seem to be getting somewhat erratic speeds, one minute its 32 down, just a minute ago it was 25. I assume that it will be like this for the first week. I must admit I'm a tad disappointed that I'm not getting the 39 that the engineers device was connecting at!
Also, my iphone4 doesnt seem to be playing nice with it. When running Speedtest on the iphone (via the app) im getting 0.5mb download? Anyone else having an issue with the iPhone4?
Shorn it's worth creating a TBB quality monitor here - http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping
That will give you an ongoing record of latency and packet loss and comes in handy to show if you've changed IP Profile in the middle of the night.
Quote from: shorn on Jan 24, 2011, 13:55:36
Also, my iphone4 doesnt seem to be playing nice with it. When running Speedtest on the iphone (via the app) im getting 0.5mb download? Anyone else having an issue with the iPhone4?
If there's one thing I've found it's that all speedtest tools on the iphone are just garbage, regardless of connection.
Ok, I've set up the TBB monitor, will see how that goes. iPhone speed is definitely not benefitting. Youtube videos are still incredibly slow. Especially compared to the way they stream on the mac.
Running the speedtest on the mac again seems to be coming through at about 25 down pretty consistently. Id be a tiny bit miffed if thats what it stays at, especially as the engineer said the lowest he'd connected anyone up at was 33mb. Again I might be jumping the gun here and it may settle down. Its just that there is still a bit difference between 25 and 35 down!
What results do you get from the BT Speedtest?
http://speedtester.bt.com/
Will post speedtester results shortly, tried a minute ago but it failed.
heres the TBB results
(http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/button/129588034086228022503.png) (http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results/id/129588034086228022503.html)
:(
Also what router are you using? Some 10/100mb routers have been shown to not have the required performance. Might be worth setting up a pppoe connection up straight from computer to modem.
Quote from: shorn on Jan 24, 2011, 14:30:11
Again I might be jumping the gun here and it may settle down. Its just that there is still a bit difference between 25 and 35 down!
Shorn, Chill - give it 2 weeks to stabilise.
Oh and there's a hell of a lot of difference between 1.5 and 25 down ;-)
Ok finally got the BT Speedtester to work...
Not great...
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5215/5384728430_c6f528c2d7_b.jpg)
I'm using the Apple Airport Extreme, configured pppoe connection. I think I have just found out that my Vodafone Sure signal will not now work as it does play with pppoe! bummer!
QuoteShorn, Chill - give it 2 weeks to stabilise.
Oh and there's a hell of a lot of difference between 1.5 and 25 down ;-)
I know, I know, normally I'm quite relaxed about these things but seeing these speeds has just got me excited!!
And this doesnt address the iPhone issue im having. Speed is very poor with the phone at the moment!
Is that via Wi-FI or 3G shorn?
Iphone issue is over Wifi. Although just ran a different speed test app and it says 14down and 0.1Up !?!?
Quote from: shorn on Jan 24, 2011, 15:16:15
Iphone issue is over Wifi. Although just ran a different speed test app and it says 14down and 0.1Up !?!?
Don't forget the iPhone is 802.11g and in the real world that's not going to be enough to test a 40mbps pipe!
I thought the Iphone4 was 802.11n but only on the 2.4g band?
The IPhone app may not understand FTTC???
Quote from: shorn on Jan 24, 2011, 15:59:35
I thought the Iphone4 was 802.11n but only on the 2.4g band?
Oops, yes you're right!
Maybe try a different channel in 2.4?
It may be congested and if everything else is in the 5Mhz band wouldn't be effected?
If you've got any wireless-'g' devices active on the network then the Airport has to fall back from 'n' to 'g'.
Quote from: Simon_idnet on Jan 24, 2011, 16:42:27
If you've got any wireless-'g' devices active on the network then the Airport has to fall back from 'n' to 'g'.
Shorn's airport is a dual band simultaneously one. It runs two SSIDs one in each pool of spectrum. Any apple hardware <4 years old will be 802.11n capable, so it's likely that his iPhone is the only device on the 2.4 band, notwithstanding PSPs, printers or other things.
Yep the phone is the only one on 2.4, the iMac and the ATV both connect via 5Ghz.
I have a feeling that the apps may just not been that good at reading the speed. I've just tried downloading an app and its seemed pretty quick to install. Will monitor!
Just did another speedtest..
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/1125690407.png) (http://www.speedtest.net)
Presumably the drop in speed is going to be down to the time of day.
Probably. Any changes in exchange loading seem to be magnified by fibre.
Quote from: shorn on Jan 24, 2011, 17:00:36
Presumably the drop in speed is going to be down to the time of day.
Not to that extent. Tried another location? What does Maidstone or Milton Keynes give you?
For example -
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/1125698853.png) (http://www.speedtest.net)
Compared with -
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/1125700142.png) (http://www.speedtest.net)
Quote from: shorn on Jan 24, 2011, 16:55:35
I have a feeling that the apps may just not been that good at reading the speed.
I'm pretty sure you're right - I've never had what I feel is an accurate answer out of an iPhone bandwidth application.
Don't get too hung up on this for now - as others have pointed out you're testing a whole chain of IP connections and pipes, and the result you get will only ever be as good as the slowest point (hence Sittingbourne versus Milton Keynes).
Why not watch a few movie trailers on Apple TV and feel the speed ;-)
I hardly ever test anymore, as the speed is now always more than "adequate" to stream some HD, do some downloading and surf too without everything slowing to a jittery crawl.
That said, I'd strongly suggest using istumbler:
http://www.istumbler.net/
to check out what's around you and move to a nice non-congested area of the 2.4 band. That should tidy up your iPhone connnection I hope.
Quote from: shorn on Jan 24, 2011, 14:30:11Its just that there is still a bit difference between 25 and 35 down!
My experience of FTTC is that a speed variation like that is nothing unusual, it seems to be
much more sensitive to congestion.
I've also got doubts about the tbb speedtester on FTTC, it usually gives me results that are well down from the "real life" speeds, eg from iTunes. The Broadband Quality meter is very useful though, albeit occasionally frightening :P
Just to echo what Bill said about the speedtester on Thinkbroadband.. Namely the fact it's absolutely useless.
All other testers reflect real world experiences but TBB speedtester is wildly inaccurate in my experience and it's a shame they refuse to acknowledge it's less than perfect.
Quote from: .Griff. on Jan 24, 2011, 18:32:00it's a shame they refuse to acknowledge it's less than perfect.
To be fair, I don't think it's the speedtester itself... when I first got FTTC it was fine, then it gradually tailed off. When BT "deleted" IDNet from the system it was fine again for a few days then slowed down, same happened when they repeated the the performance, same again when one of IDNet's core routers (?) fell over, and on other odd occasions when there's been some sort of "event" on the 'net that would affect routing.
I'm as convinced as I can be that BT do something different to data coming in via FTTC...
It all comes to Milton Keynes, where they employ an army of otherwise unemployable geeks to randomly select bytes to discard, Bill. ;D
So that's what you do all day? :out:
I've spoken to both Seb and Andrew in the past with an idea to find out what the issue was/is but their simple response was "it's fine.. Must be your fault" rather than accept there's some issue with IDNet/FTTC and the test.
For general info, a graph since I first got FTTC:
Quote from: Glenn on Jan 24, 2011, 18:49:23
So that's what you do all day? :out:
:nana: ;D
Actually, I didn't like to own up for fear of being lynched. ;)
Quote from: .Griff. on Jan 24, 2011, 18:50:21
I've spoken to both Seb and Andrew in the past with an idea to find out what the issue was/is but their simple response was "it's fine.. Must be your fault" rather than accept there's some issue with IDNet/FTTC and the test.
Yeah, I've noticed >:(
Not many on FTTC yet though, hopefully if/when they get enough complaints they'll
have to look into it
So some time in the next decade then, to judge by BT's progress to date. ;)
Probably :(
But if it is BT messing about, tbb likely won't be able to do much about it... which would be a pity, 'cos basically it's a good tester.
As has been mentioned, I think I'm not going to worry to much about speed tests. In real world uses it seems great. I just bought the complete Alan Partridge off iTunes. I think there was about 6.7Gb worth in total. Started it off, watched a 40 minute episode of the US Office, and by the time it was finished the download was done! Thats amazing! That would have normally taken about 10 hours!!
Sounds about right ;D
Provided I don't get stuck with a badly congested link, I usually reckon about 5-6 minutes/GB.
It's one of the potential problems with fibre- it makes it far too easy to spend money with iTunes :P
Quote from: Bill on Jan 24, 2011, 20:16:52
It's one of the potential problems with fibre- it makes it far too easy to spend money with iTunes :P
And indeed urinate your data cap up the wall at an alarming rate... ;-)
I have found though, 4 months in, that data usage passes through an alarming bump and then settles down once the red mist of connection has worn off!
Quote from: Anton on Jan 24, 2011, 21:20:29
And indeed urinate your data cap up the wall at an alarming rate... ;-)
Yup- given a link that allowed me to max out the line, I could go through a month's (peak hours) usage allowance in a little under 2 hours :eek4:
OK well its been 8 days now since it was installed. So it's getting close to the recommended 10 days for the speed to settle. I'm getting around 20mb down and 8 up.
(http://www.speedtest.net/result/1138230177.png) (http://www.speedtest.net)
This is about the best I can get from the Speedtest site. (And this is the best from all the servers.)
I would have to say that I'm a tad disappointed that its not really close to the minimum 27mb down that was predicted. Don't get me wrong, the extra speed is great over the 1.5mb I was getting, however I am paying over £25 more a month than I was before!
I also find that I am getting some sites that load quite slowly. Most sites are fine, things like the BBC news site is up in no time, however sites like MacRumours seem to load 90% then hang for 5 seconds or so (where I get the beachball and cannot use it), and then finish loading.
I'm pleased, but not quite as stoked as I thought I would be.
Quote from: shorn on Feb 01, 2011, 21:15:57
I also find that I am getting some sites that load quite slowly. Most sites are fine, things like the BBC news site is up in no time, however sites like MacRumours seem to load 90% then hang for 5 seconds or so (where I get the beachball and cannot use it), and then finish loading.
Can be an MTU problem... make sure it's set to at least 8 less on the computer than on the router, eg 1492/1500.
PPPoE overhead.
Last Few....
Date Time Down Up Latencey
1/24/2011 9:23 AM GMT 25.07 7.76 20 Sittingbourne 0
1/24/2011 9:25 AM GMT 23.22 7.85 20 Sittingbourne 0
1/24/2011 9:35 AM GMT 30.11 7.83 20 Sittingbourne 0
1/24/2011 11:00 AM GMT 32.5 7.87 23 Sittingbourne 0
1/24/2011 11:14 AM GMT 32.49 7.87 21 Sittingbourne 0
1/24/2011 2:28 PM GMT 25.71 7.85 21 Sittingbourne 0
1/24/2011 4:58 PM GMT 11.01 7.91 21 Sittingbourne 0
1/24/2011 5:54 PM GMT 18.33 5.13 20 Sittingbourne 0
1/24/2011 5:55 PM GMT 4.59 1.23 421 Newbury 100
1/29/2011 11:44 PM GMT 19.03 7.17 21 Sittingbourne 0
1/29/2011 11:45 PM GMT 24.32 6.85 40 London 50
1/29/2011 11:45 PM GMT 21.69 7.22 28 Aubervilliers 200
1/29/2011 11:46 PM GMT 24.53 7.36 22 Ashford 50
02/01/2011 21:07 GMT 20.75 7.35 42 Maidstone 50
02/01/2011 21:07 GMT 15.28 4.98 21 Sittingbourne 0
02/01/2011 21:10 GMT 21.88 7.96 31 Coventry 100
The Sittingbourne server gives me awful results as well but I see you've tried Maidstone once and that generally gives me the most accurate results.
What result do you get from this ? - http://www.mybroadbandspeed.co.uk/
That has always been reliable for me.
QuoteWhat result do you get from this ? - http://www.mybroadbandspeed.co.uk/
(http://www.mybroadbandspeed.co.uk/results/74742531.png) (http://www.mybroadbandspeed.co.uk)
How have things panned out Shorn? Has the rate recovered any?
Quote from: .Griff. on Jan 24, 2011, 18:50:21
I've spoken to both Seb and Andrew in the past with an idea to find out what the issue was/is but their simple response was "it's fine.. Must be your fault" rather than accept there's some issue with IDNet/FTTC and the test.
They aren't BT employees are thay?
;D
They'd be quite insulted at the suggestion.
Oh well, that's me banned from tbb then ;D
;D
QuoteHow have things panned out Shorn? Has the rate recovered any?
Well its settled out at about 20mb. Sometimes a tad more, sometimes a bit less. Still very up and down.
Ok, well having just read Jemmm's thread HERE (http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,24680.0.html)
I thought I would try wiring my connection. (been using the wireless connection from the Airport on the iMac to the Airport extreme.)
Connected a run of Cat 5e and got the following result...
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5138/5428671821_378af4592d_b.jpg)
This is actually a LOT better than I've been getting lately. iMac is being moved upstairs soon, So I will definitely be investing in a run of network cable!
Still, it is a tad annoying when the Openreach engineer connected it up and said that his equipment was showing 39mb down and the full 10 up. even 27 is quite a drop from that.
Quote from: shorn on Feb 08, 2011, 21:23:59
This is actually a LOT better than I've been getting lately. iMac is being moved upstairs soon, So I will definitely be investing in a run of network cable!
Still, it is a tad annoying when the Openreach engineer connected it up and said that his equipment was showing 39mb down and the full 10 up. even 27 is quite a drop from that.
Are you sure your iMac is connected over the N protocol? Shift your N network into the 5Ghz range and have it running alongside the g/b connection. I run 2 SSIDs (FELIX and FELIX_N) and therefore two WLANs independent of each other.
I'm running my _N WLAN in the 5GHz band and my speedtest over airport Extreme N maxes out at circa 38mbps. It also has the advantage that it'll much less crowded up at the higher frequencies - you do lose a little range at the margins, but as both WLANs are available you can easily reselect to the lower frequency one if you want to surf in your garden shed for any reason. ;-)
You beat me to it Anton ;D
Yep, pretty sure its on the 5Ghz range. Under the Airport Utility>Wireless, I have it set to 802.11a/n - 802.11b/g with Radio Channel Selection set to Automatic.
Not 100% sure of this because I haven't tried it, but I think the way to be certain is to click "Wireless Network Options", check the "5GHz Network Name" box and enter a different name.
Then connect computers to that SSID, and you can be sure they're using 5GHz and not picking up something else "automatically".
Actually, it looks like it wasn't! Just found the additional wireless setting it configure 5Ghz range! So I have done that now and I get the following results....
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5259/5429689760_669ed136bb_b.jpg)
I mean, does that seem acceptable and right to people? It just seems like its on the low side of a 40mb service.
Looks a bit low for this time of night, but you can never be sure with BT... try again tomorrow morning.
I've been getting these kinds of speeds, if not lower for the last week or so now. I was hoping I would have had something steady over 30, but maybe I'm expecting too much.
Have you tried using the separate SSID for 5GHz as I mentioned above (and Anton mentioned earlier)? We posted almost simultaneously so you may have missed it.
Yes, I have now found out that I did not originally have it running a 5Ghz band, but I have now reconfigured the Airport Extreme so I have both. Connected my iMac into the 5Ghz band, and then ran the test and got the last result I posted above.
Looks like there's something cock-eyed somewhere then- I've just done a BT speedtest and got 30315 down and 7944 up, on a 33598 profile.
But I'm on wired Ethernet to the router... Don't know what to suggest :dunno:
hmmm, is it worth putting in a call or email to support?
Had the engineer not told me that he connected in at 39down 10up, and that hadn't connected anyone in lower than 31down, I probably wouldn't have minded as much.
And i also wouldn't mind if it was some cheap broadband from somewhere, but I am paying a premium. My mate gets a nice solid 10mb down with Sky through normal adsl, and pays £7.50 a month, no limits.
Im paying nearly five times that for just over double the speed.
If I had over 30 i'd be satisfied, but I've not seen over 30mb since the morning it was installed.
You've got a profile of 38717 which means you're sync'ing at max, and my gut feeling is that the problem is at your end.
I don't think it's worth calling support unless you get the same (lack of) speed on a wired connection... there must be some way you could do that, even on a temporary lash-up?
I'm pretty sure it's the first thing support will ask you to do.
The thing is I don't seem to be getting that much better speed when connecting via Ethernet. The screenshot above the last was my result via Ethernet and that was 27 down.
Ah, sorry, I thought it was wireless (need to read more closely!)... in that case I'm out of ideas and a call to support seems the best option to me.
Yea, think I'm going to have to. I'll get three speedtest results over wired connection and then submit them. See what they have to suggest.
Thanks for your help and suggestions.
Quote from: shorn on Feb 09, 2011, 01:21:09
Yea, think I'm going to have to. I'll get three speedtest results over wired connection and then submit them. See what they have to suggest.
Thanks for your help and suggestions.
To completely eliminate the router interfering connect your PC's RJ45 directly to the modem by plugging it in the LAN1 BT FTTC Modem (or whatever the port is called).
Establish a PPPoE connection (http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows-vista/Create-a-PPPoE-connection-to-the-Internet for Windows 7)
Fill in your username and password, most likely it's your phonenumber@idnet.gw6 or something similiar and your PW (you can find these in your IDNet Control Panel).
It will automatically connect over PPPoE when you "dial" it up, now do some speedtests on mybroadbandspeed.co.uk, speedtest, speedtester.bt.com.
If these ones come out as 28 Mbps then you've eliminated I'd say pretty much all things that could interfere, perhaps a different CAT 5 Cable or time of the day will net you more speed :)
Quote from: sof2er on Feb 09, 2011, 03:47:12
Establish a PPPoE connection (http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows-vista/Create-a-PPPoE-connection-to-the-Internet for Windows 7)
Shorn uses an iMac :P
TBH I'd be very surprised if the AEBS is causing a problem, it's a fast router.
But fair point, it's worth checking.
Quote from: Bill on Feb 09, 2011, 10:48:03
TBH I'd be very surprised if the AEBS is causing a problem, it's a fast router.
We checked Shorn's router before he signed up - he's using the same model as mine and it's the current one.
The WAN port on his model and the WLAN can both handle 60mbps without their pulses ever going above 70 ;-)
The CAT5 has out scoped Wireless as the issue, so for my money it's a WAN problem - I certainly think it's worth involving support.
From what I've seen round here, BT have planned the FTTC cab roll outs not to suit the existing infrastructure but to suit maximum speed, but in the end it may just be that Shorn's unlucky and further than average from his CAB and as Shorn is still on the max IP profile, so throughput does look low. I wonder what the backhaul is like into his Exchange?
I use an AEBS as well, latest model and firmware, so I know what it's capable of :thumb:
Quote from: Bill on Feb 09, 2011, 12:25:25
I use an AEBS as well, latest model and firmware, so I know what it's capable of :thumb:
You mean Zoooooooooooooooom!? ;D
Well gonna get another reading today, and will definitely be contacting support. Speed seems to be dropping further.
Downloading at just after 12am this morning, and again just now, when maxing out my connection I am only getting a download speed of about 1000KB/sec. Before I was getting close to 2500KB/Sec.
Bit disappointed with the speed so far, and this further drop takes the biscuit!
Was hoping for good things from this move to Fibre but have so far been quite underwhelmed.
A lot of people have seen teething troubles when first moving to fibre (just as we previously saw with Max and then ADSL2). Have a word with support.
This was speed test just taken. (Connect via ethernet to the AEBS)
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5055/5450688477_e237daf4d0_b.jpg)
Sadly, that falls within BT's acceptable range, so it may be harder to get BT to investigate.
Yep, just called support. They basically said "tough" its down to BT, nothing they can do. Pretty cr*p really.
To be honest if tis is an indication, I would have been better off staying with Sky for and sucking up the slower speed. At least that stayed consistent!
Fibre's a black box technology still, there's no self-help and little an ISP can do if it's within BT's spec. :(
I suppose its one of those things that you get when you sign up early to something. Overpriced and not tested well enough. Heres hoping the service and choice will get better with time!
I do wish BT and ISP's would call it by its proper name, VDSL, the fibre transport only extends to the cabinet, then you have to content with the DLM nonsense.
A real fibre connection would run at 100 Meg or more consistently.
Would the super pro package make a difference bearing in mind it gives you priority over ADSL traffic?
I would consider it although I'm kinda loathed to hand over more money for the added benefit!
I've not tried vDSL, but on ADSL, the business package, which has the same priority, definitely showed advantages.
VDSL2 Rik, not VDSL ;)
How about VDSLx? ;D
Go on then.. I'll let you have that one :P
:thumb: ;D
Quote from: .Griff. on Feb 17, 2011, 00:56:03
VDSL2 Rik, not VDSL ;)
The 2 button on my keyboard wasn't working ;D
As in GOTO? ;)
;D
Ok, still bit confused by this...
I had a carpet fitted today so all my kit was taken out and unplugged, and has all now been put back. Thought it would be interesting to see what speeds I was getting today.
Did a BT Speedtest and its up to 25mb down, and 5up. Thats a bit closer to what it was, however... when I go to download something (via newsgroups so it should max out my connection, it starts a bit higher, but gradually (over a minute) drops back down to near dead on 1000 KB/sec. Now that speed is certainly not indicative of a 25mb connection. It's like the newsgroup downloads has been throttled? Is there another way I can test downloading a file to see if it happens form somewhere else on the net?
I take it back, Im a complete dumbass!
Had my newgroup client set to throttle at 1000kbps. What a knobber. :red:
:lol: an easy one for us to sort!
;D
Thanks for letting us know, Shorn.