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Technical News & Discussion => Windows News & Discussion => Topic started by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 13:17:43

Title: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 13:17:43
My Seagate Barracuda 160 Gb HD has gone on the fritz :( Am going to have a go at replacing it (never done it before :eek4:) is there anything I should look out for when replacing? Do most HD's have the same or similar connections? Is it simple to install?

Amazon have a good deal on a Western Digital http://www.amazon.co.uk/Generic-Hard-Disk-Drive-500GB/dp/B000OUG69K/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1262956370&sr=8-10  Any comments welcome ;) I am not looking for the best just something to tick over with.

Look forward to your replies, thanks
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Ray on Jan 08, 2010, 13:24:06
The main thing you need to watch, Q, is whether your Seagate drive is  an IDE or Sata one, and ensure the new one is the same, otherwise swapping an HD is fairly straighforward.  :)
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 13:25:46
Thanks Ray, how can I tell the difference?
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Tacitus on Jan 08, 2010, 13:26:19
I've just fitted a couple of Caviar drives in the Power Mac - a 500Gb (Caviar Blue) and a 640Gb.  One of them, not sure but I think it's the 640, has an annoying hum, but apart from that both seem fine.

Over the years I've found Western Digital pretty reliable, although I don't think they're always the fastest on the market.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 13:27:21
Ray

Update, just found a small sticker saying IDE. Thanks again.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 13:28:26
Tacitus

Is the Caviar Blue IDE?
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Steve on Jan 08, 2010, 13:33:16
Top one is IDE

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Glenn on Jan 08, 2010, 13:33:33
http://www.ebuyer.com/search?store=2&cat=4&subcat=379 are ebuyers selection of IDE drives, does your PC have sata conectors on it, as the drive will be cheaper?

Sata motherboard connector looks like this

(http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/ASRock/939SLI32-eSATA2/images/sata.jpg)
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 13:44:27
Glenn

Nope, it does appear that it is IDE.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Glenn on Jan 08, 2010, 13:47:27
Then something like http://www.ebuyer.com/product/129413 will do depending on your budget
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 13:47:42
Any suggestions as to which IDE to go for. As I say, not wanting a Rolls Royce version just a simple mini or mondeo type. (apologies to any mini or mondeo owners) but you know what I mean ;)
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 13:52:54
Quote from: Glenn on Jan 08, 2010, 13:47:27
Then something like http://www.ebuyer.com/product/129413 will do depending on your budget

Glenn

Thanks for the help is the one you mention definitely IDE version?
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Glenn on Jan 08, 2010, 13:55:44
Yes it is, or any from the post above http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=18076.msg435666#msg435666
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Tacitus on Jan 08, 2010, 14:37:02
Quote from: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 13:28:26
Is the Caviar Blue IDE?

No, mine's SATA, but Dabs have the IDE/ATA version (http://www.dabs.com/products/western-digital-caviar-se16-500gb-u133-16mb-4L6H.html?refs=52420000) albeit at a price...

Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 14:51:08
Thanks Tacitus

Have ordered one from Amazon for £59.03 with free delivery. So, it's  :fingers: when I start fitting it  :eek4:
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Glenn on Jan 08, 2010, 14:57:43
Fitting it the easy part, only 4 screws and 2 connectors. Do you need to istall an OS on it at all?
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Steve on Jan 08, 2010, 15:01:26
If its IDE it may need a jumper on it (sensible advice this weather) just set it the same as the existing one, to no jumper if it's the only drive on ribbon or if two to master or slave. (a CD/DVD drive may be attached as slave)
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 08, 2010, 16:05:26
Quote from: Steve on Jan 08, 2010, 15:01:26
If its IDE it may need a jumper on it (sensible advice this weather)

;D
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 16:40:13
Quote from: Glenn on Jan 08, 2010, 14:57:43
Fitting it the easy part, only 4 screws and 2 connectors. Do you need to istall an OS on it at all?

Glenn

Yes I do need to install an OS.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 16:41:18
Quote from: Steve on Jan 08, 2010, 15:01:26
If its IDE it may need a jumper on it (sensible advice this weather) just set it the same as the existing one, to no jumper if it's the only drive on ribbon or if two to master or slave. (a CD/DVD drive may be attached as slave)

Thanks Steve.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Steve on Jan 08, 2010, 17:10:24
Quote from: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 16:40:13
Glenn

Yes I do need to install an OS.

Can you image the old one before it dies although a new hdd  is a good reason to get rid of all the detritus.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Simon on Jan 08, 2010, 17:15:42
I've always set my jumpers to cable select.  Is that not a good idea?  It always seems to work.  :dunno:
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 08, 2010, 17:16:24
If you've got the right cable, that's fine...
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Simon on Jan 08, 2010, 17:22:08
If it fits without a hammer...  ;D
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Steve on Jan 08, 2010, 17:22:25
Look what I found

All newer IDE/EIDE hard drives can be jumpered as Cable Select (CS or CSEL). This is an alternate way to indicate which drive is master and which drive is slave (instead of jumpering one drive as master and one drive as slave). Cable Select jumpering requires a special IDE cable with wire 28 not connected to one of the drive connectors, which would configure the drive attached to that connector as the slave drive.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Glenn on Jan 08, 2010, 17:25:10
HP have been using it for years Steve, I don't know the last time I had to jumper a data cable.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 08, 2010, 17:29:27
Given up the knitting, Glenn? ;D
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Steve on Jan 08, 2010, 17:30:03
Is there much use of IDE these days?
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 08, 2010, 17:31:31
Possibly in external drives, Steve.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Glenn on Jan 08, 2010, 17:31:45
Since most systemboards lost jumpers, and you no longer have to configure IRQ, DMA and com port settings, things are a lot easier.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Glenn on Jan 08, 2010, 17:33:30
Quote from: Steve on Jan 08, 2010, 17:30:03
Is there much use of IDE these days?

Not really Steve, that's why they are expensive compared to SATA drives, IDE is old technology.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 08, 2010, 17:34:08
I sometimes feel I am too.  :'(
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 18:03:01
Hi! Guys

Appreciate all the input. All these 'jumpers', 'slaves' and 'masters' are beginning to get me worried. Can I not just connect up the new HD with the 'old' connections? Looking at the now removed Seagate Barracuda there does not appear to be facility to change any settings :dunno:
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 08, 2010, 18:10:25
What does the cable look like, Q, is it just one smooth ribbon or is there a split in it?
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 18:11:23
Quote from: Steve on Jan 08, 2010, 17:10:24
Can you image the old one before it dies although a new hdd  is a good reason to get rid of all the detritus.

Steve

Have a backed up image via Acronis on an external HD but have no idea how to transfer the image to the new drive when it arrives.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 08, 2010, 18:12:17
Unless it's a like for like drive, ie same size, I wouldn't try, Q. Start from scratch instead.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 18:19:07
Quote from: Rik on Jan 08, 2010, 18:10:25
What does the cable look like, Q, is it just one smooth ribbon or is there a split in it?

Rik

There are two that connect to the HD one joined black cable and one with a red, yellow and two black thin cables.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 18:20:42
Quote from: Rik on Jan 08, 2010, 18:12:17
Unless it's a like for like drive, ie same size, I wouldn't try, Q. Start from scratch instead.

I think that is the way I will go.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 08, 2010, 18:21:23
The coloured wires are the power connector and should terminate in a four pin connector, which is keyed at the corners, so will only go in one way.

Is the other cable flat or round?
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Gary on Jan 08, 2010, 18:23:42
And have you got a Windows OS disc Q?
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 18:31:56
Rik, cable is flat.

Gary, yes, I have a Windows XP Professional disc.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 08, 2010, 18:34:46
Just check any jumpers on the drive you've taken out then, Q.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: esh on Jan 08, 2010, 18:36:17
If you only have one drive per IDE cable then it can be master or slave, it doesn't matter (you can have two drives per cable). The other likely thing you'll have is a CD-ROM drive which will also be IDE. This could be on the other IDE connector (named secondary) or it might be a slave on the primary. If you set both to slave or both to master, the BIOS won't find either, it's that simple. The easiest thing is to do cable select. No jumpers often simply means 'best effort' on modern hard drives, so try that first if you are unsure. To clarify you CAN do:

Primary -- Master: hard drive. Slave: CD-ROM drive
Secondary -- None

Primary -- Master: hard drive. Slave: none.
Secondary -- Master: none. Slave: CD-ROM drive.

Primary -- Master: hard drive. Slave: none.
Secondary -- Master: CD-ROM drive. Slave: none.

You CANNOT do

Primary -- Master: hard drive. Master: CD-ROM drive. Slave: none.
Secondary -- None.

Primary -- Master: none. Slave: hard-drive. Slave: CD-ROM drive.
Secondary -- None.

Make sure you are using 80-wire conductor cable as well. That might sound stupid, but the old 40-wire conductor cable is very very poor, for hard drives at least. As an alternative, you may consider buying a cheap PCI SATA card and buying a SATA hard drive. No jumpers. No nonsense.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Gary on Jan 08, 2010, 19:08:22
Quote from: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 18:31:56
Rik, cable is flat.

Gary, yes, I have a Windows XP Professional disc.
:thumb: It should be easy Q, and a nice fresh install  ;D
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 08, 2010, 19:22:35
Thanks all. Appreciate the quick and useful response :thumb: :thumb:
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 15, 2010, 12:07:46
Help!

The new WD HD arrived this morning, lo and behold has completely different connections to the old HD :dunno:

The attachment below will show the differences, New 500Gb WD HD on left & Old 160Gb Seagate on right. Your views and any help would be appreciated.

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 15, 2010, 12:12:06
The one on the left looks like a standard IDE drive, Q, can't really make out the one on the right, but I'm wondering if it's SATA.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Ray on Jan 15, 2010, 12:13:12
It is a SATA drive, Rik.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 15, 2010, 12:13:38
Thanks, Ray.  :thumb:
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 15, 2010, 12:21:07
As I reported in an earlier post there is a small sticker on the old Seagate (on right) that states it is IDE :dunno:
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 15, 2010, 12:22:39
Can you do a close up on the connectors of the old drive and also of the label, Q?
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Simon on Jan 15, 2010, 12:24:02
You can get SATA to IDE adapters from most computer shops, Q.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 15, 2010, 12:28:35
Rik, Will do.

Simon, Is this what I need and is it fairly easy to attach? http://www.amazon.co.uk/SATA-Data-Power-Combo-Cable/dp/B000M1EB70/ref=pd_bxgy_ce_img_a

OR is it easier to return the new HD and start again?

Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 15, 2010, 12:30:25
The latter if you can, Q.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Steve on Jan 15, 2010, 12:31:09
I think I'd start again although you could keep it as I'd be very surprised if the motherboard's not got an IDE connector you would just need to find a ribbon ,you may have one attached to DVD drive but it would need to have a spare connector.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 15, 2010, 12:32:29
Probably the best. Can you confirm that I need a Sata drive?
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Simon on Jan 15, 2010, 12:35:26
Sorry, Q, I can't see the link at the moment, but I used an adapter to connect an old IDE drive to a SATA board, and it works OK, but take the advict of those who know better than me.  :)
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 15, 2010, 12:39:05
Quote from: Steve on Jan 15, 2010, 12:31:09
I think I'd start again although you could keep it as I'd be very surprised if the motherboard's not got an IDE connector you would just need to find a ribbon ,you may have one attached to DVD drive but it would need to have a spare connector.

I've had a look and there appears to be a spare connector on the ribbon, does that provide power as well?
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 15, 2010, 12:40:51
No, you need the 4 pin power connector, Q.
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Steve on Jan 15, 2010, 12:42:00
The ribbon does not supply power and you may see a performance hit using an IDE drive. To your previous question if the drive in your picture is your old one on the right that is SATA
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: quandam on Jan 15, 2010, 13:02:54
Executive decision made, I will return it. Amazon returns system is the best, just printed off the label for a free return and full refund, so easy, brilliant :thumb:

Off to the Post Office in the next few minutes :thumb: Thanks for your help. Could someone just confirm that the old Seagate in picture is a Sata drive please?
Title: Re: New Hard Drive
Post by: Rik on Jan 15, 2010, 13:06:40
Steve has done, Q.