I have been with IDNET for several years now, and the customer service and reliability has always been good. I'm on the Home Lite package which provides 5GB inclusive downloads for £17.61/month.
Recently however, I have noticed that NewNet, who seem to be rated just as highly as IDNET, are offering 12GB downloads on their Home M package at £16.59/month. Does anyone have any experience of NewNet, and does anyone else feel that IDNET are now very uncompetitive ?
Chris.
I don't think IDNet are uncompetitive, Chris, taking the overall package, ie including the level of service. There are cheaper ISPs, of course. I would suggest you don't make any firm decisions until January. Can you move to WBC?
Rik,
No unfortunately, my local exchange does not currently support ADSL2+.
Chris.
Shame. Well, as I say, I'd wait a month or so before making a decision.
Quote from: Rik on Dec 09, 2009, 13:02:14
Shame. Well, as I say, I'd wait a month or so before making a decision.
??? ??? ???
you heard some thing Rik??
BT are changing their pricing in January, then we need to wait to see how the ISP's react.
I asked the same question last week, when Rik mentioned it.
Here you go Baz http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=17494.msg417565#msg417565
Just heard on the news, the 50p broadband tax is to be implemented :mad:
Let's just call it a tax, Bob, like motoring taxes, I have a feeling little will be used for the claimed purpose.
Quote from: cs2008 on Dec 09, 2009, 11:46:12
I have been with IDNET for several years now, and the customer service and reliability has always been good. I'm on the Home Lite package which provides 5GB inclusive downloads for £17.61/month.
Recently however, I have noticed that NewNet, who seem to be rated just as highly as IDNET, are offering 12GB downloads on their Home M package at £16.59/month. Does anyone have any experience of NewNet, and does anyone else feel that IDNET are now very uncompetitive ?
Chris.
I was with NewNet for a few years before coming to IDNet. Good company and in some ways similar to IDNet - fairly small (Esp. compared with the 'big boys'), very good service and (In my opinion) good value for money. Only reason I changed was that they modified their bandwidth caps downwards and the package I was on was no longer suitable for me. Having said that, I'm pleased that I changed as the service here is as good if not better, prices are good and reliability is 1st class!
NewNet counts upload as well as download, so the allowances aren't quite as generous as they first appear. That said if you don't upload many pictures to a web site it might be worth the move.
I did consider them before moving to iDNet. The stumbling block was they said there was no weekend support period, whereas iDNet do appear to have a rota system for emergencies (= loss of service). Given they do a lot of business stuff - particularly hosting - I imagine there is someone there 24/7, so I can't see why there shouldn't be a skeleton staff available on the broadband side. Still that's a business decision for them.
One place they do score is on hosting. Take a look at their PowerHosting packages. If you want your own domain mainly for email, the base package is not bad value. Not as cheap as PurpleCloud, but not drastically overpriced IMO and, from a firm with a good rep.
There are rumours around that BT are revising their pricing in the New Year, so it may be that iDNet will be revising their packages. From past example I imagine this will be in the form of greater allowances rather than price cuts, so it might be worth holding fire for a while.
If you pay yearly and wish to cancel early NewNet will not refund the difference, you lose the lot :eek4: Whereas IDNet still maintain the one month cancellation contract :thumb:
I've been with a few providers and all despite their promises turned out to be rubbish, until I joined Idnet. Yes they are dearer than some, but I get what I pay for, and at the moment reliability is worth the price but of course nothing is set in stone.
I am perfectly happy with Idnet but I have to say Zen was also a great Isp. I only moved because of the download limit on Zen.
In the end it all depends on what you regard as 'value for money'. One person's 'value' is someone else's 'rip-off'.
Too often people regard 'cheap' and 'value' as meaning the same thing.
Quote from: Tacitus on Dec 10, 2009, 08:09:59
In the end it all depends on what you regard as 'value for money'. One person's 'value' is someone else's 'rip-off'.
Too often people regard 'cheap' and 'value' as meaning the same thing.
Very true, and then they cry and shout when it goes wrong :(
If it aint broke........
take it apart to find out why.
Then, like my fathers watch, I might not be able to get it back together again!
Just had another bulletin from Idnet on the RS feed, it seems more problems, loss of service Etc, they seem to be getting more frequent :dunno: , I realise they are not Idnet problems but down to BT in most cases, but is this a sign of things to come, I do hope not :eyebrow:
Quote from: Broadback on Dec 10, 2009, 09:27:22
Then, like my fathers watch, I might not be able to get it back together again!
And my brother, with his radio
Quote from: talos on Dec 10, 2009, 09:27:25
Just had another bulletin from Idnet on the RS feed, it seems more problems, loss of service Etc, they seem to be getting more frequent :dunno: , I realise they are not Idnet problems but down to BT in most cases, but is this a sign of things to come, I do hope not :eyebrow:
There have been major outages with LINX and Telehouse in London, which is currently affecting a lot of ISPs. I received notification from my hosting company.
It could well be related http://www.idnetters.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=17583.msg419311#new
You wouldn't naturally associate Mill Hill with Watford, would you.
At a guess, someone has cut the cable :red:
The problem with the MUXes and nodes is that they concentrate things from a large geographical area to a small, but intense, centre. Failures now affect much larger numbers of people.
http://btbusiness.custhelp.com/app/service_status/ss_id/13266/ss_cat/2467,2383 is the direct announcement.
FWIW this is what I received last night from Clook:
QuoteWe have received confirmation from LINX that they are currently experiencing difficulties with a core switch located in Telehouse East on their Brocade LAN.
Unfortunately this issue has caused congestion on a multi-10G link bundle between Telehouse North and Sovereign House.
LINX are currently working on the issue and hope to restore full connectivity shortly.
Please note that we (Clook) are not directly affected by this issue, however access ISPs who rely on LINX connectivity to reach us may be experiencing difficulties if they do not have enough capacity through backup transit providers.
Thanks, Tac. :thumb:
It appears this has now been fixed (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/12/10/linx_failure/).
As always, there seems to be little or no redundancy in the system. :(
Quote from: Tacitus on Dec 09, 2009, 16:42:52
NewNet counts upload as well as download, so the allowances aren't quite as generous as they first appear.
Yes that's a good point, although I seldom UL as much as I DL, so the 12GB allowance from Newnet does look attractive.
However, if IDNet are going to revise their allowances in Jan, I should hang on for a while yet.
Chris.
Quote from: Rik on Dec 10, 2009, 17:12:52
As always, there seems to be little or no redundancy in the system. :(
This has been said before, I thought the new system allowed for better redundancy? Or are we still balanced on a coins edge, Rik?
I believe plans for new pricing have been put back to March, Chris, to allow IDNet to give more to those who are not on WBC-enabled exchanges.
Quote from: Gary on Dec 16, 2009, 13:22:43
This has been said before, I thought the new system allowed for better redundancy? Or are we still balanced on a coins edge, Rik?
It does within IDNet, Gary, but BT's network seems very fragile and if one of the concentrator points fail, it affects a lot of people.
Quote from: Rik on Dec 16, 2009, 15:33:23
It does within IDNet, Gary, but BT's network seems very fragile and if one of the concentrator points fail, it affects a lot of people.
BT, forever the weak link and slowly getting worse the more strain is put on it :sigh:
I know, but I think they are beginning to realise that they, too, can lose business as people switch to LLU. The signs are that they are trying harder.
Quote from: Rik on Dec 16, 2009, 15:46:17
I know, but I think they are beginning to realise that they, too, can lose business as people switch to LLU. The signs are that they are trying harder.
Well thats a good sign, Rik. Better than the Ostrich approach, I mean it could be worse, we could have Berlusconi as head of BT ;D
You mean we don't? :o ;D
Quote from: Rik on Dec 16, 2009, 16:02:02
You mean we don't? :o ;D
;D if we did there would be some interesting engineers :evil:
Some interesting AGMs too. ;D
Quote from: cs2008 on Dec 09, 2009, 11:46:12
I have been with IDNET for several years now, and the customer service and reliability has always been good. I'm on the Home Lite package which provides 5GB inclusive downloads for £17.61/month.
Recently however, I have noticed that NewNet, who seem to be rated just as highly as IDNET, are offering 12GB downloads on their Home M package at £16.59/month. Does anyone have any experience of NewNet, and does anyone else feel that IDNET are now very uncompetitive ?
Chris.
IDnet are certainly the best ISP I've been with, but then the competition isn't brilliant because I've only ever been with IDnet, BT OpenWoe and Tiscali. Seriously though, the basic connectivity has been very reliable and quick - although there were those issues with email a while ago. :rant2:
I have to say though that I could do with a higher download cap on the basic service. I was on the higher capped service but didn't get anywhere near that limit, but now I tend to "hit the buffers" - would be nice to have a few more GB / month without having to increase the monthly outgoings permanently.
Wonder if we will ever get a decent ISP that offers an "affordable" (under £20 / month) unlimited service to us hard pushed rural types stuck on BT lines for the foreseeable? I'm not hopeful ::)
Unlimited is not economically viable for an ISP, Chris, so those who offer it usually restrict its use, by FUP and throttling.
Quote from: Rik on Dec 19, 2009, 20:05:03
Unlimited is not economically viable for an ISP, Chris, so those who offer it usually restrict its use, by FUP and throttling.
Problem is though Rik, that if we move in the direction that the politicians (etc.) want us to move in (streamed multi channel HD TV over IP etc.) its going to be vital to have un-throttled affordable provision- Basically if expectations are going to meet actuality, we are going to need one hell of a lot of infrastructural improvement in the UK. I can see us being left way behind a lot of countries. A good place to start on this path is to for "officialdom" to take a hard look at BT and all its works (or lack of them !) :mad:
I would say, to answer your basic question, that NewNet provide a very similar service to IDNet, however, there are slight differences that can sway your decision.
For me, I like to pay yearly (to save money) and IDnet offer the facility with the one month contract in place whereas NewNet will charge the full amount should you wish to cancel within the 12 month contract.
As in most things today you pays your money and takes your choice :dunno:
Quote from: chrisga on Dec 19, 2009, 20:17:55
Problem is though Rik, that if we move in the direction that the politicians (etc.) want us to move in (streamed multi channel HD TV over IP etc.) its going to be vital to have un-throttled affordable provision- Basically if expectations are going to meet actuality, we are going to need one hell of a lot of infrastructural improvement in the UK. I can see us being left way behind a lot of countries. A good place to start on this path is to for "officialdom" to take a hard look at BT and all its works (or lack of them !) :mad:
Couldn't agree more, Chris. The best ISPs can only deliver what the BT network will allow them to, and the network is sadly lacking. :(
Quote from: Rik on Dec 20, 2009, 09:35:31
Couldn't agree more, Chris. The best ISPs can only deliver what the BT network will allow them to, and the network is sadly lacking. :(
I know some (all?) of the LLU operators such as O2, C&W etc, have their own networks, but are these
completely independent of BT? Isn't there some degree of overlap somewhere - obviously the local loop is still over BT wires. Surely to a large extent they must all run over BT infrastructure?
Obviously the cable operators are pretty much independent but that independence means they've dug up the streets and put their own stuff in. Can't say I've noticed the others doing the same. :)
No-one supplying an ADSL service is independent of Openreach, they all use the 'last mile', they all have their equipment installed and maintained by Openreach. The difference starts on the 'other' side of the DSLAM/MSAN, where the service is handed off to the LLU network, rather than the BT one.
I was just over at AAISP wondering if they are cheaper than IDNET because some of you use them and say nice things. After about 10 minutes of reading the prices pages I gave up. Units, type of line, time of day? Obviously Messrs. A and A are very clever chaps; so clever I need a spreadsheet to work out what a service would cost. Can any AAISP users tell me what my £17.61p IDNET service would cost with them?
TBH, Dave, I've never been able to work out their new tariffs. To know whether they suit you, you have to know what bandwidth you use when. It's horribly complex, a bit like trying to compare mobile phone tariffs.
I agree on the pricing plans, they're as complex as railway fares and a much simpler system would be desirable.
I dream of the day when the infrastructure will allow us all to have unlimited download allowances and guaranteed speeds sufficient for all the things the internet is capable of providing such as this. (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8426104.stm)
I'm not holding my breath though :(
I agree with Rik it is complicated for the average user. What they need is a web based calculator. However, based on my interpretation of their system, people on the iDNet 5Gb Max package would gain a higher off peak allowance under the AAISP system.
TBH, unless you are touching the 5Gb limit and really need the extra, I wouldn't bother to move unless you have other reasons for doing so. I'm not sure, but aren't BT looking at revised prices in the new year, which would impact on all the BT based ISPs? This will probably affect those on WBC more than the ones on max, but it will be down to the individual ISP to pass on any price reductions.
A&A might be beating others to the punch with their new system.
Right! You would need one of our outstanding ::) non diluted ::) degrees to understand what they are offering. If you do 'manage' to achieve one of these 'coveted' ::) degrees you may well still have problems ;)
I suppose I could work out how much it would cost to use an AAISP product, but, I was so amazed by the nerd tariff I thought why bother. What's wrong with something like 5Gb for a tenner? May be it is a selection process designed to ensure only members of Mensa get admitted. Maybe the router has a funny handshake. All I can tell you is I failed the entrance test.
I think you're making it out to be a bigger issue than it really is, purely because it's a different system to what other BT Wholesale reliant ISPs traditionally use.
AAISP's peak time is 9am-6pm weekdays. If the majority of your Internet usage/downloads is within that period, then they'll probably be expensive compared to alternatives. If however your usage is mainly from 6pm onwards and weekends, then they can be very good value.
For example: If everyone in the household worked away from the home during the daytime (therefore the vast majority of the household's Internet usage falls into AAISP's off-peak period), then for the same price as Idnet's Home Plus package (£17.99, 40GB/month limit), I could use a two unit package with AAISP to give me a 200GB/month off-peak limit.
Why is adsl2 cheaper than adsl?
I think it's because BT sell it to the ISPs cheaper, Lona, but I don't know the technicalities as to why it's cheaper.
Quote from: dujas on Dec 24, 2009, 00:27:05
AAISP's peak time is 9am-6pm weekdays. If the majority of your Internet usage/downloads is within that period, then they'll probably be expensive compared to alternatives. If however your usage is mainly from 6pm onwards and weekends, then they can be very good value.
Fair enough, but are the 'units' ring fenced to peak and off-peak? If I have two units, does one of them get used
only in peak hour and the other only during off-peak? Suppose the peak hour unit gets used up, do I then need to purchase another peak hour unit or do I start eating into what's left of my off-peak?
Does this apply only to WBC connections or does it also include those on vanilla Max? If it does include those on Max then it is probably better value than iDNet since Max users are limited to 5Gb total. Those on WBC get enhanced allowances which are more competitive with the AAISP offering.
In the end it depends on individual usage patterns and whether you are on WBC.
Quote from: Lona on Dec 24, 2009, 00:36:04
Why is adsl2 cheaper than adsl?
BT charge significantly less, Lona, presumably because their costs are lower. That enables ISPs to pass on the savings as greater bandwidth allowances or lower prices. IDNet have gone the bandwidth route, presumably because they are aware of the increased levels of use by most customers. When I joined, the £17.99 package was 2GB/month, it then went to 5GB and I needed that extra. Now it's 10 peak and 30 off peak, and I find myself straying a little higher. I think they've made the right decision as the web becomes more 'media rich'.
I just wish I could get adsl2 but my area will be one of the last places to have it, just like when BB was available I had to wait for ages. >:(
Well, hopefully there will be some good news for you next spring. :fingers:
Same here Lona, we seem to lag well behind the cities, but curiously the MOD base up the road has a super-fast system, wish I could plug in an extension.
Want to borrow a shovel? ;)
QuoteFair enough, but are the 'units' ring fenced to peak and off-peak? If I have two units, does one of them get used only in peak hour and the other only during off-peak? Suppose the peak hour unit gets used up, do I then need to purchase another peak hour unit or do I start eating into what's left of my off-peak?
Does this apply only to WBC connections or does it also include those on vanilla Max? If it does include those on Max then it is probably better value than iDNet since Max users are limited to 5Gb total. Those on WBC get enhanced allowances which are more competitive with the AAISP offering.
1. You can use the units as you wish. At 17.5% VAT a unit with AAISP costs £3, now as a 20CN customer that unit pays for 1GB of data downstream peak time or 100GB off-peak. But you can break that unit up so its value is used up over different periods, e.g. 50GB off-peak, 512MB peak etc.
2. It applies to both 20CN and 21CN ADSL connections, the only difference is that for 21CN customers with AAISP, their units give 25% more downstream allowance during peak time (from January onwards). Unlike Idnet, AAISP didn't pass on the cost reduction of a 21CN connection straight away to its customers.
I have given up on AAISP, but I had not realised how expensive adsl is versus adsl2+, or rather how much better the allowance is, in my case 5GB versus 30 GB for £17.61. Now that might make me look around. So this might be a good time to improve the adsl Home Plus package until it can be upgraded. Given recent network enhancements at IDNET it hard to believe some extra allowance cannot be found just to temper the apparent inequity.
Watch and wait, Dave. ;)
:great:
Quote
I agree with Rik it is complicated for the average user. What they need is a web based calculator.
Ask and ye shall be given!. (http://www.aaisp.net.uk/broadband-units.html) :)
Makes it much clearer.
We have a date for 21CN as forth quarter 2011 but no date at all for WBC :(
My thoughts on Idnet pricing are stolen from some distant advert, but I cannot remember which product it was for
"Reassuringly Expensive"
Stella Artois?
Is she a member of the support team ? ;)
She may be but I don't truss my memory. ;D
Quote from: Rik on Dec 24, 2009, 18:51:20
Stella Artois?
Give the man a prize Stella Artois (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t5ys55MLA6U&feature=related) :thumb:
Great ad. :thumb:
Quote from: talos on Dec 24, 2009, 10:21:16
Same here Lona, we seem to lag well behind the cities, but curiously the MOD base up the road has a super-fast system, wish I could plug in an extension.
You can have the access, but you have to use their IT support, it's dire from what my friend tells me at Cosford. Even the worst ISP look great in comparision. :evil:
IDNET are unfortunately still limited by BT's equipment, which means you are paying more for less than someone on LLU.
I pay 7 quid a month for O2 8meg and it's unlimited downloads, for this on IDNET would cost me a fortune.
However when I was on IDNET, it's definitely reliable, I've had a couple of problems with O2 but nothing major.
To cut a long story short, IDNet can compete in exchanges without the big llu players being there, but if you have Be* or O2 available then I'm afraid the prices at idnet are blown out of the water.
Quote from: wrtpeeps on Dec 25, 2009, 11:13:04
IDNET are unfortunately still limited by BT's equipment, which means you are paying more for less than someone on LLU.
I pay 7 quid a month for O2 8meg and it's unlimited downloads, for this on IDNET would cost me a fortune.
However when I was on IDNET, it's definitely reliable, I've had a couple of problems with O2 but nothing major.
To cut a long story short, IDNet can compete in exchanges without the big llu players being there, but if you have Be* or O2 available then I'm afraid the prices at idnet are blown out of the water.
I would agree, but I also pay for a one month rolling contract, and O2's DNS servers are not know for reliability even on LLU, I used to be on O2 LLU with them till I moved, I live at a BT only exchange now. O2 are now implementation a throttling of heavy users as they cannot support the demand for bandwidth due to that all you can eat policy on the access sides, this may spread to LLU as the network becomes congested sadly
I got my invoice today and noticed I had gone over my 5GB allowance. I had reinstalled windows and various programmes generating quite a lot of update activity. That rather brought home to me what poor value for money 5Gb for £17.99 represents, not least when I run under. An increased peak allowance and some form of carry over would definitely be welcome soon. We live in a world where Moore's Law abounds, but, I have not noticed it applying to my broadband service as I approach my two year anniversary.
That's mainly because BT's pricing structure doesn't follow Moore's Law, Dave. Hopefully, there will be some better news in the New Year, but at the moment, the harsh economics are that BT charge more for bandwidth on Max than they do on WBC. :(
Quote from: Rik on Dec 29, 2009, 10:39:22
That's mainly because BT's pricing structure doesn't follow Moore's Law, Dave. Hopefully, there will be some better news in the New Year, but at the moment, the harsh economics are that BT charge more for bandwidth on Max than they do on WBC. :(
hat I fear will cause issue as a gulf open sup between those on WBC and those who may actually never get it, when BT say no date exsists for WBc that means what? You never get adsl2+ so you are stuck with older technology at a higher price, even though that is the nature of the beast, and not IDnets fault people will probably not see it that way :(
Just wait till the New Year, Gary.
Quote from: Rik on Dec 29, 2009, 10:39:22
That's mainly because BT's pricing structure doesn't follow Moore's Law, Dave. Hopefully, there will be some better news in the New Year, but at the moment, the harsh economics are that BT charge more for bandwidth on Max than they do on WBC. :(
That is a predictable answer that serves to antagonise more than ameliorate. If you are saying that no increase in allowance over two years is down to BT, then you are suggesting that IDNET has done nothing to improve operating efficiencies over that period, or if it has, it has not shared them with the customer.
What improvements would you suggest, Dave?
Quote from: Rik on Dec 29, 2009, 10:53:23
Just wait till the New Year, Gary.
Will do, Rik. :)
Quote from: Rik on Dec 29, 2009, 11:08:25
What improvements would you suggest, Dave?
On my ADSL line Newnet seem to offer 12GB for £17.56 compared with IDNET's 5GB for £17.61 at present, with I presume similar BTW ADSL.
What are their WBC packages like, Dave?
Quote from: Rik on Dec 29, 2009, 11:44:22
What are their WBC packages like, Dave?
I have only looked at ADSL, which is all I can get here.
Max http://www.newnet.co.uk/broadband/home.php
ADSL2+ http://www.newnet.co.uk/broadband/home24.php
They may have chosen to use WBC to cross-subsidise Max, I don't know. I do know that the largest element of IDNet's costs are the money they pay to BT, and that limits their room for manoeuvre. That said, BT prices should be coming down next month, so maybe IDNet will be in a better situation to restructure their tariffs after that.
Quote from: Rik on Dec 29, 2009, 11:53:03
They may have chosen to use WBC to cross-subsidise Max, I don't know. I do know that the largest element of IDNet's costs are the money they pay to BT, and that limits their room for manoeuvre. That said, BT prices should be coming down next month, so maybe IDNet will be in a better situation to restructure their tariffs after that.
Let us hope so, especially if Newnet follow BTW pricing down. On the other hand maybe they have anticipated it to pinch a few customers ahead of time.
Time will tell, Dave.
Quote from: Rik on Dec 29, 2009, 13:15:59
Time will tell, Dave.
Meantime, and reading back over this thread, it seems to me some of the problems arise because of the large gaps in download allowance between packages and where the breakpoints are compared with other providers. It might be worth considering infill packages and it would certainly be worth looking at some carry forward.
Quote from: davej99 on Dec 29, 2009, 11:37:57
On my ADSL line Newnet seem to offer 12GB for £17.56 compared with IDNET's 5GB for £17.61 at present, with I presume similar BTW ADSL.
NewNet are offering 12GB in total (ie up
and download). iDNet charge for downloads only, so the products are not strictly comparable. I did suggest on another thread that iDNet might be wise to consider selling total bandwidth on the NewNet model, since few people upload a great deal.
What operating efficiencies would you suggest? How exactly could they cut costs in order to offer significantly cheaper prices? Given they shared the reduction in costs with their customers, when they moved to WBC, I can't really see how they could do much else. The only alternative would be to spread those costs across to Max and subsidise Max customers at the expense of those on WBC. Or they could do like everyone else and cut support costs....
Quote from: Tacitus on Dec 29, 2009, 14:06:49
NewNet are offering 12GB in total (ie up and download). iDNet charge for downloads only, so the products are not strictly comparable. I did suggest on another thread that iDNet might be wise to consider selling total bandwidth on the NewNet model, since few people upload a great deal.
What operating efficiencies would you suggest? How exactly could they cut costs in order to offer significantly cheaper prices? Given they shared the reduction in costs with their customers, when they moved to WBC, I can't really see how they could do much else. The only alternative would be to spread those costs across to Max and subsidise Max customers at the expense of those on WBC. Or they could do like everyone else and cut support costs....
It is of course correct to say IDNET have a large number of advantages over similar competitors, including free upload, superb tech support, low cost extra useage, flexible contracts, many extras and so on. However, for ADSL lines, Newnet are offerring 12GB for £17.56 compared with IDNET's 5GB for £17.61. That equates to £1.46 versus £3.52 per GB. You would have to do a lot of uploading to close the gap and I suspect that few non-biz users would come close.
I do not intend to advise IDNET on operating efficiencies or suggest that they do not pursue them. In a well run business this is not a matter of sacrificing quality or service to reduce costs, but of being very smart. It is a business given and customers expect to see the benefit. Nor do I intend to advise or speculate on pricing policy, except to agree that price is not the only factor in this premium segment of the broadband market, where a price differential versus the rest is largely tolerated. However, between competitors in the premium segment, it is harder to accept.
My point is very simple; there is a significant price differential between competitors for some customers in the premium segment and I would be grateful if this could be addressed.
I do know that IDNet are aware of this, Dave, and are thinking hard about how best to implement the forthcoming BT price cuts.
Quote from: davej99 on Dec 29, 2009, 15:55:59
........Newnet are offerring 12GB for £17.56 compared with IDNET's 5GB for £17.61. That equates to £1.46 versus £3.52 per GB. You would have to do a lot of uploading to close the gap and I suspect that few non-biz users would come close.
Which is pretty much the point I made above and have also made elsewhere, that iDNet should consider moving to a total bandwidth model... :) I imagine it would depend on how BT are structuring their prices. I'm sure iDNet are well aware of what the competition is doing.
Quote from: davej99 on Dec 29, 2009, 15:55:59
In a well run business this is not a matter of sacrificing quality or service to reduce costs, but of being very smart....
Would that many more of the UKs bigger businesses took your advice.. With most of them, slashing costs, and using cheap labour (aka outsourcing) is the name of the game. Quality and service are well down the line for many of them - the customer is simply someone to be milked for profit.
Quote from: davej99 on Dec 29, 2009, 15:55:59
It is of course correct to say IDNET have a large number of advantages over similar competitors, including free upload, superb tech support, low cost extra useage, flexible contracts, many extras and so on. However, for ADSL lines, Newnet are offerring 12GB for £17.56 compared with IDNET's 5GB for £17.61. That equates to £1.46 versus £3.52 per GB. You would have to do a lot of uploading to close the gap and I suspect that few non-biz users would come close.
I do not intend to advise IDNET on operating efficiencies or suggest that they do not pursue them. In a well run business this is not a matter of sacrificing quality or service to reduce costs, but of being very smart. It is a business given and customers expect to see the benefit. Nor do I intend to advise or speculate on pricing policy, except to agree that price is not the only factor in this premium segment of the broadband market, where a price differential versus the rest is largely tolerated. However, between competitors in the premium segment, it is harder to accept.
My point is very simple; there is a significant price differential between competitors for some customers in the premium segment and I would be grateful if this could be addressed.
Overall a very well thought out , fair and common sense post that should be taken on board for the benefit of all, including IDNet themselves. :thumb:
Thank you for your kind words, Q. Having thrown in my two pence on pricing I am content to wait and see what IDNET come up with. I have always thought IDNET very responsive and customer oriented and I would be surprised if we do not see an appropriate response.
Dave,
I felt your pain.
I was in your position and would occassionally go over the 5Gb limit (I play Lotro and once a new digital expansion was announced, bang there goes my allowance) but more often than not I was well under the 5Gb limit.
I was considering a move away to get more than 5Gb and Newnet are a good option (if you dont use Photobox like I do now!!) as I could not justify the hike to get teh next Idnet package up.
I was saved by moving to WBC with IDNET and for the same money got a much larger donwload limit, even though on my very long line it was marginal if it would work. I gained no more speed but was only concerned about the increased download limit.
I guess I am lucky BUT if it had not worked and IDNET were not able to increase the 5Gb limit then I too would have to consider other non IDNET options.
I have been with IDNET for a few years now and rate them very very highly, I see no reason ever to leave and luckily do not have to now.
I wish you well and can only hope you find a suitable solution.
Regards
Richard
I said it before, and I will say it again. IDNet offer the prices and download limits to fit the service they CAN deliver.
I cannot comment on all providers, just on O2. They offer the undercut price, and the extra unlimited bandwidth. However, they CANNOT deliver that service. Hence the bottleneck slowdowns and disconnects on their HomeBroadband service.
I know of a lot of companies (Banking industry anyone?!) who promise the world to the customers, when they already know they have sold out. They just hope the customer does not download, or check their account, want the delivery, or ask for a service before the company gets things sorted and the product on the shelves.
Quote from: Technical Ben on Jan 05, 2010, 19:28:16
I said it before, and I will say it again. IDNet offer the prices and download limits to fit the service they CAN deliver.
I cannot comment on all providers, just on O2. They offer the undercut price, and the extra unlimited bandwidth. However, they CANNOT deliver that service. Hence the bottleneck slowdowns and disconnects on their HomeBroadband service.
I know of a lot of companies (Banking industry anyone?!) who promise the world to the customers, when they already know they have sold out. They just hope the customer does not download, or check their account, want the delivery, or ask for a service before the company gets things sorted and the product on the shelves.
Thats more so on the Home access package which is BT based, there LLU is much better as its running of Be's network which they bought
I agree there. If O2 had LLU on my exchange, I would have no problems. At least as long as O2 don't make the same mistake again. However, you are not being fair there. IDNet have a fair extra ammount of bandwidth allowance on their equivalent (21cn wbc asdl2+).
So your comparing Other LLU providers to IDNets ASDL resell product and complaining IDNet are not as good? If you use compare LLU providers ASDL resell product, it's not even usable most of the time. (Sky free home, O2 home access, Etranet etc!) ;)
However, if you think IDNet are not the best deal for the entry levels of product, then that is a fair opinion. They also seem to have a few gaps in the pricing/usage limits, as it jumps from 5gb to 30gb with no option in between. I'd love a 15gb package. :/
Quote from: Technical Ben on Jan 07, 2010, 10:30:22
They [IDNET] also seem to have a few gaps in the pricing/usage limits, as it jumps from 5gb to 30gb with no option in between. I'd love a 15gb package.
I would be good to see IDNET review ADSL pricing and it has been suggested that this may happen. However, scope may be limited because of BT's pricing policy. I agree with Ben and think that a package that sits in the gap between 5 and 30GB is a useful alternative for some of us, perhaps re-jigging the ADSL packages a bit at the same time. I would be reluctant to jump ship to a cheaper provider and get hit with peak time congestion, which seems common among the large ISPs and unproven with others.
IDNet are listening to customers...
Quote from: Rik on Jan 07, 2010, 11:15:39
IDNet are listening to customers...
All the evidence supports that. My observation is that the company also puts its case openly. In return we customers should listen carefully and be reasonable in what we ask for. A little give and take goes a long way.
That's what we aim to do in the forum, create a platform for debate that allows IDNet to get customer feedback on a range of issues. ;)
And you succeed very nicely! :thumb:
:thnks: